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Post by rihannsu on Jan 9, 2012 22:57:29 GMT -5
Sadly I think one of the main reasons that Adam has not been immediately recognized for his enormous talent is that the general public no longer has any ability to recognize that talent. Some of the incredible nonsense that I have read in comments by people who are supposedly "vocal coaches" tells me that there are an awful lot of people making money teaching voice lessons who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. Does anyone know what kind of qualifications are required to teach "voice lessons" or is it the case that anyone can call themselves a voice teacher.
The combination of reduced music education in schools leaving kids without the exposure to trained voices and the odd prejudice that exists in the Pop/rock world towards trained vocalist have resulted in the average joe being completely unable to recognize truly incredible skill when it is in front of them. Add to that the prejudice within the classical vocal community against pop/rock music leading many who should recognize his talent instead turning their noses up and it just leaves me shaking my head. Just the fact that there isn't a single note anywhere in his documented range which he can't deliver with the power and clarity just blows me away. Many singers who may have a great range between the high and low end of their range also have fairly large sections within that are weak or poorly supported. I've NEVER heard anyone who could deliver with the kind of consistency Adam does across their ENTIRE range.
I think Meatloaf oddly enough hit the nail on the head in his comment that people just simply do not understand how phenomenal Adam's talent is. I think many have lost the ability to appreciate the level of training and technical ability Adam has mastered and the fact that he makes it seem so easy makes it even harder for people to realize how incredible it is. These days we tend to recognize degree of effort more than actual skill. We acknowledge effort more than the actual mastering of skill. We get a rush watching struggle but not mastery.
I've been shaking my head over the discussion of the EMA performance on DDD because it seems that none of these people is capable of recognizing true emotions. They don't hear intensity in Adam's delivery because he is not straining to hit the notes. They have no true understanding of what intensity is all about. Is this the end result of a generation raised being given rewards for effort rather than actual achievement? Can people no longer truly recognize mastery of a skill but rather only the amount of effort being put into play? Tonight I watched the BCS National Championship and the performer who sang the National Anthem was introduced as someone who sang Opera but it was an atrocious rendition as far as vocal quality. I thank god we have Angelina because she is one of the few vocally trained people who seem to truly understand how incredible Adam is at what he does. It gives me hope that someday he will truly be recognized. In my own mind I have absolutely no doubt that if Adam had gone into to pure Opera he would undoubtedly be right up there with Pavarotti and Domingo, etc.
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Post by cassie on Jan 9, 2012 23:10:47 GMT -5
I agree with you from the beginning word to the end. Thanks for writing.
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Post by cassie on Jan 9, 2012 23:27:20 GMT -5
I posted this today (1/0/2012) on the daily thread, but since it was prompted by the discussion here I thought I would also post it here for archive purposes. Adam Lambert Fan club Fever Cover Video Via Italian FAN CLUB member Myky Petillo: hi i'm an italian singer (and i'm a glambert too XD) and i've performed in an italian tv show "Fever".... hope u will like  .... thanks 4 watching :D:D:D The guy gives a very credible performance of the song. Can’t fault him (except for his difficulty with pronunciation). But, because I was just over in the masterclass posting, I thought I would bring the topic over here and point out one of the things we love about Adam’s voice, which is the wonderful way he combines the power of his chest voice and the ringing quality of his head voice. This guy uses his chest voice throughout the song. At the beginning, where it is low (and yes, he did lower the key from the one Adam uses in GNT) his chest voice works well and is clear. But when he goes for the higher notes he pushes the chest voice up to them without any of the ring/ping of a head voice. Listen at :38 when he goes up to sing “sometimes. Would you be mine, would you be mine”. Do you hear the difference? Do you hear the push? Vs. Adam who has power and ping? And then at about :43 he goes up further for the third “would you”, that is too high to push his chest voice so he flips into falsetto for those two notes. If you are used to Adam’s rendition, that flip and wimpy sound is jarring. This guy dumps all the power out of the top of the phrase. Of course, he doesn’t even attempt the glory note (an F#5 from Adam). To me, comparing the two vocals gives a nice example of how many other pop singers sound okay, even good, but Adam’s voice just feels so much better, fuller, brighter, alive. Do you hear what I mean? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2012 23:51:04 GMT -5
Hi Cassie, I have a question regarding the falsetto discussion. When Kelly Clarkson was asked if she had seen any of AI8 early in 2009 she said that she had seen Adam sing 'Tracks of my Tears' and he sung the whole song in falsetto. Was any of it falsetto?
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Post by cassie on Jan 10, 2012 1:05:26 GMT -5
Hi Cassie, I have a question regarding the falsetto discussion. When Kelly Clarkson was asked if she had seen any of AI8 early in 2009 she said that she had seen Adam sing 'Tracks of my Tears' and he sung the whole song in falsetto. Was any of it falsetto? Well, that is a tricky question. (And I confess up front that I am a classically trained vocalist and a female, so singing falsetto was never part of my training, so I am going on what I have been told, not what I have experienced myself). First, one has to define head voice and falsetto. However, the definition you will get from vocal experts is NOT the same as you get from a general audience. Generally speaking, people refer to falsetto as being any high, light male voice without any chest resonance. So, using that definition, Kelly is correct. The "authorities" will tell you that head voice refers to that part of your register or range where the main resonance comes from the sinuses and bones in your head rather than the resonance down in your chest like you use for your speaking voice. Falsetto refers to a style where you do not completely bring your vocal cords together, but just barely brush them, letting out a lot of air or hiss; weak in intensity and with little power. Most often used with higher notes. So, technically speaking, Adam is using head voice on the high notes while combining the head resonance with some chest resonance on the low notes (which is something many singers cannot do. It is one or the other, but not a blend, and certainly not a blend that retains the light timbre rather than the chest voice power). There is no breathiness and lack of ring that is associated with falsetto. But, to the layman, those light, high notes are "falsetto", while the low, richer notes are your regular singing voice. So, either Kelly doesn't understand the technical terms, or she is opting to use the terms understood by the general public. Did that answer your question or confuse you more? |
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Post by eri9 on Jan 10, 2012 3:40:19 GMT -5
Thanks for your response to my post, Cassie!
I have never come across across a singer that is so versatile and could literally sing any genre he chooses.
I had a wee epiphany a while back..... an opera fan friend of mine asked me "what is it about Adam Lambert?" (I think we've probably all been asked that at some point, and it is actually extrememely difficult to answer!! ;D )
Anyway, I got to thinking, and came up with this:
I grew up with an opera singer father, and was exposed to great singers through both opera and musical theatre. Although I enjoy and appreciate opera, my real love is musical theatre. So much wonderful show songs that I can imagine Adam doing amazing things with!!! (but that's a whole other discussion! :D)
As a teen in the 80's I loved pop music too. I always had some music on, either top 40 radio or a cassette (and later CD) of Les Mis or Miss Saigon or any other numerous musicals....
SO..... I finally realised that Adam is the first person (and most likely the only person ever!) to bring these two musical worlds together. A classically trained singer with a musical theatre background who sings pop songs like no other!!!!
Almost 3 years on, and I have heard him serenade me every day! Sometimes it is just on in the background, and is so familiar, it is just there, but other times I really want to sit and listen and concentrate on that stunning voice that continues to blow my mind!!!
And I love this thread SFM!!!! Thanks Cassie for all your insights! Looking forward to more analysis of new music (and those incredible vocals) very soon!! :L)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2012 9:16:24 GMT -5
Hi Cassie, I have a question regarding the falsetto discussion. When Kelly Clarkson was asked if she had seen any of AI8 early in 2009 she said that she had seen Adam sing 'Tracks of my Tears' and he sung the whole song in falsetto. Was any of it falsetto? Well, that is a tricky question. (And I confess up front that I am a classically trained vocalist and a female, so singing falsetto was never part of my training, so I am going on what I have been told, not what I have experienced myself). First, one has to define head voice and falsetto. However, the definition you will get from vocal experts is NOT the same as you get from a general audience. Generally speaking, people refer to falsetto as being any high, light male voice without any chest resonance. So, using that definition, Kelly is correct. The "authorities" will tell you that head voice refers to that part of your register or range where the main resonance comes from the sinuses and bones in your head rather than the resonance down in your chest like you use for your speaking voice. Falsetto refers to a style where you do not completely bring your vocal cords together, but just barely brush them, letting out a lot of air or hiss; weak in intensity and with little power. Most often used with higher notes. So, technically speaking, Adam is using head voice on the high notes while combining the head resonance with some chest resonance on the low notes (which is something many singers cannot do. It is one or the other, but not a blend, and certainly not a blend that retains the light timbre rather than the chest voice power). There is no breathiness and lack of ring that is associated with falsetto. But, to the layman, those light, high notes are "falsetto", while the low, richer notes are your regular singing voice. So, either Kelly doesn't understand the technical terms, or she is opting to use the terms understood by the general public. Did that answer your question or confuse you more? Thanks for explanation. I thought the first 'eyes baby eyes' in Music Again was an example of Adam using falsetto but now I'm not so sure. It doesn't sound feathery or airy to me. Please would you point out examples of Adam's falsetto? |
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Post by cassie on Jan 10, 2012 21:41:49 GMT -5
Well, that is a tricky question. (And I confess up front that I am a classically trained vocalist and a female, so singing falsetto was never part of my training, so I am going on what I have been told, not what I have experienced myself). First, one has to define head voice and falsetto. However, the definition you will get from vocal experts is NOT the same as you get from a general audience. Generally speaking, people refer to falsetto as being any high, light male voice without any chest resonance. So, using that definition, Kelly is correct. The "authorities" will tell you that head voice refers to that part of your register or range where the main resonance comes from the sinuses and bones in your head rather than the resonance down in your chest like you use for your speaking voice. Falsetto refers to a style where you do not completely bring your vocal cords together, but just barely brush them, letting out a lot of air or hiss; weak in intensity and with little power. Most often used with higher notes. So, technically speaking, Adam is using head voice on the high notes while combining the head resonance with some chest resonance on the low notes (which is something many singers cannot do. It is one or the other, but not a blend, and certainly not a blend that retains the light timbre rather than the chest voice power). There is no breathiness and lack of ring that is associated with falsetto. But, to the layman, those light, high notes are "falsetto", while the low, richer notes are your regular singing voice. So, either Kelly doesn't understand the technical terms, or she is opting to use the terms understood by the general public. Did that answer your question or confuse you more? Thanks for explanation. I thought the first 'eyes baby eyes' in Music Again was an example of Adam using falsetto but now I'm not so sure. It doesn't sound feathery or airy to me. Please would you point out examples of Adam's falsetto? Yes, it is confusing, because the term falsetto seems to be mis-applied to any light high notes, often technically "head voice." The thing is, many singers do not know how to switch into head voice confidently, or how to control it when they do. Even if they do it with confidence, they don't know how to get much head resonance or ringing. Don't know how to aim the tone into their "mask." The result is a kinda wimpy, dull, light sound. Not breathy as in true falsetto, but not like a normal singing voice. So they have two options when going for those high notes. They can really push the chest voice into almost a scream, or they can sing in head voice/falsetto/whatever you call it, and lose all power, clarity, and volume. Adam is a different sort of animal. First, he has the anatomy to create wonderful sonic resonance in his head. And, secondly, he knows exactly how to use it and maximize it with fine control. Again, think of that last "neeeeeeeeeeeed" in TOFT. Slowly increasing in intensity and then ebbing away. Masterful. Truthfully, I cannot think of a song where I would say Adam was singing with what is technically called falsetto. I think it is all head voice. As you noted, way too much ring and ping to be falsetto. More educated vocal expert may disagree with me, but that is what I hear. And, why would Adam need to sing in falsetto when he can so completely control the tone and intensity and volume without it? For those of you who are interested in the more scientific and technical explanation of what the vocal cords do when singing in chest voice, head voice, and falsetto, check this out. |
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Post by cassie on Jan 10, 2012 21:51:14 GMT -5
Thanks for your response to my post, Cassie! I have never come across across a singer that is so versatile and could literally sing any genre he chooses. I had a wee epiphany a while back..... an opera fan friend of mine asked me "what is it about Adam Lambert?" (I think we've probably all been asked that at some point, and it is actually extrememely difficult to answer!! ;D ) Anyway, I got to thinking, and came up with this: I grew up with an opera singer father, and was exposed to great singers through both opera and musical theatre. Although I enjoy and appreciate opera, my real love is musical theatre. So much wonderful show songs that I can imagine Adam doing amazing things with!!! (but that's a whole other discussion! :D) As a teen in the 80's I loved pop music too. I always had some music on, either top 40 radio or a cassette (and later CD) of Les Mis or Miss Saigon or any other numerous musicals.... SO..... I finally realised that Adam is the first person (and most likely the only person ever!) to bring these two musical worlds together. A classically trained singer with a musical theatre background who sings pop songs like no other!!!! Almost 3 years on, and I have heard him serenade me every day! Sometimes it is just on in the background, and is so familiar, it is just there, but other times I really want to sit and listen and concentrate on that stunning voice that continues to blow my mind!!! And I love this thread SFM!!!! Thanks Cassie for all your insights! Looking forward to more analysis of new music (and those incredible vocals) very soon!! :L) Preach it, baby! Yup. A confluence of many influences coupled with artistic creativity to imagine how to blend them together to approach many different genres, and the determination and dedication to keep working to perfect it. That's our Adam. |
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Post by cassie on Jan 12, 2012 1:40:03 GMT -5
Posted on the daily thread (dead - sorry I was so late responding) and brought over here to archive. Kelly Clarkson - National Anthem Dead thread, and hours late, but I finally got around to listening to this. Before commenting, tho, I think we should refresh our minds with an example of how it should be sung. Now, as to Kelly, first of all, disregard the pitches printed on the video. Not accurate. But, to the delivery.... a little pitchy on a couple of notes, but, overall, nice job. That left me cold. I am not fond of all the riffs she takes. Guess it sounds too country for me. But, my big complaint is that she does not seem to be thinking about the meaning of the words and how they are set to music. She breaks up a phrase several times for no other reason than that she runs out of breath. Not surprising as she is pushing the notes pretty hard. For example, "What so proudly we [breath] hailed [breath]", or "o'er the ramparts we [breath] watched [breath]". Her riffs don't seem to be tied much to the lyrics either, and I just don't hear any interpretation of the words. Note, this is the way that the national anthem is usually sung. Yes, it is more challenging than most pop music, vocally, but the emphasis seems to be on impressing with improvised riffs, rather than on finding the point of the lyrics. Contrast that with Adam's. He sings, "were so gallantly streaming." Hear how he attacks the G? That emphasizes the word, saying the flag was not only waving but was waving BRAVELY. "And the rockets' red GLAAAAAAAAAARRRRRREE (wait for it, wait for it, the rockets are still lighting up the night sky) [yeah, I admit, it is showing off, too, but, as opposed to other singers, it matches the lyrics], the bombs bursting [breath] (okay, you say, isn't he breaking the phrase like you complained that Kelly was? Yes, but for a very different reason. It is lyrical. He takes a breath there in order to sing) "in air gave PROOF [breath]". (And, folks, that is the point of the poem/song. That while agonizing over the probable US defeat, the only thing keeping the author hoping thru the night is the fleeting glimpses of that flag during the bomb bursts, still aloft over the US fort. Most everyone I hear sing the NA phrases it "bombs bursting in air [breath] gave proof [breath] thru the night [breath]." No attention to the meaning of the phrase.) Then he repeats what kind of proof. "proof thru the night [breath] that our flag [breath] (yes, what about the flag?) WAS STILL THERE!!!!" Where the melody normally goes down on that last phrase, Adam takes it up in a declaration. Even the next throw away words, "oh say" he sings, "oh SAY does that...." It is an exhortation to proclaim, to shout it out loud; the flag, even today, is still waving! "O'er the land of the FREEEEEEEEE". Yes, every singer worth their salt will do something with that note, as it is the climax of the song. Unfortunately, many do as Kelly does, and flip into a light head voice, dumping the power out of the word. Adam belts it out for all it is worth. But, he is not finished. For most singers, the last line is an afterthought. Adam sings, "and the home of the........ [wait for it, wait for it] BRAVE. Disregarding the difference in tone, the difference in the ring in the voices, just listening to interpretation of the MEANING, can you hear the difference? |
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.... thanks 4 watching :D:D:D
