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Post by willowgarden on Mar 18, 2011 23:44:03 GMT -5
musicgirl: Thanks for posting those youtubes of your native folk music. There is something beautiful and moving about male voices together in a cappella harmony, isn't there? You find such groups in so many genres and cultures. Here in the US we used to have barbershop quartets who sang in those close harmonies with no accompaniment. Not many are still doing it, but male a cappella singing re-emerges every generation, it seems. There have been college male singing groups and fraternity singing groups from way back when, too. The boy bands of the '80s were another incarnation. Today we have the urban beat box style. I enjoy this example of male a cappella singing (from Sweden): Just beautiful ! What is it, Cassie, that makes siblings singing together so special? My favorite duo, the Everlys, sounded like one voice sometimes, and I could never figure out how they could do that. They also fought like cats and dogs most of the time, but when they opened their mouth to sing, it was just heavenly. I always thought Phil Everly had the corner on singing "way up there" until I heard Adam. www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIIlQmdsfX8 |
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Post by cassie on Mar 19, 2011 2:10:32 GMT -5
musicgirl: Thanks for posting those youtubes of your native folk music. There is something beautiful and moving about male voices together in a cappella harmony, isn't there? You find such groups in so many genres and cultures. Here in the US we used to have barbershop quartets who sang in those close harmonies with no accompaniment. Not many are still doing it, but male a cappella singing re-emerges every generation, it seems. There have been college male singing groups and fraternity singing groups from way back when, too. The boy bands of the '80s were another incarnation. Today we have the urban beat box style. I enjoy this example of male a cappella singing (from Sweden): Just beautiful ! What is it, Cassie, that makes siblings singing together so special? My favorite duo, the Everlys, sounded like one voice sometimes, and I could never figure out how they could do that. They also fought like cats and dogs most of the time, but when they opened their mouth to sing, it was just heavenly. I always thought Phil Everly had the corner on singing "way up there" until I heard Adam. www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIIlQmdsfX8I think that siblings singing together sound good for a couple of reasons. First, I notice that my two sisters and I, and to a certain degree, my sisters' two daughters all sound somewhat alike when speaking. Probably because we heard the same voices and vocal patterns/accents growing up. That transfers to singing together. We also heard the same music while growing up, so tend to sing with somewhat of a similar style. Then, I suppose that there is harmony in just knowing each other so well and for so long that adds harmony to the singing. Finally, there may be some genetically similar anatomical structures that give our voices similar resonance. At least, those are my guesses. |
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Post by musicislife on Mar 19, 2011 9:08:25 GMT -5
Cassie - I see you are back and I'm looking forward to hearing your take on Adam's Aftermath performance on AI. If you reviewed it in one of the news threads, then I apologize for missing it. I ventured an opinion on why he wasn't flat (even though it may have sounded like he was) and HSM copied it over here (page 9). I may be completely wrong, and I probably didn't use the right terminology (vocals were not my area of study) but I'm interested to know how you hear it.
Someday I'd love to hear you expand a little more on the different types of voices one sings in - chest, head, blended, etc. I have a pretty good idea but I'd like to be able to distinguish the different types more easily. His register switching is so unnoticeable though, it may be hard to tell even after your tutorial!
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Post by cassie on Mar 19, 2011 10:20:11 GMT -5
Cassie - I see you are back and I'm looking forward to hearing your take on Adam's Aftermath performance on AI. If you reviewed it in one of the news threads, then I apologize for missing it. I ventured an opinion on why he wasn't flat (even though it may have sounded like he was) and HSM copied it over here (page 9). I may be completely wrong, and I probably didn't use the right terminology (vocals were not my area of study) but I'm interested to know how you hear it. Someday I'd love to hear you expand a little more on the different types of voices one sings in - chest, head, blended, etc. I have a pretty good idea but I'd like to be able to distinguish the different types more easily. His register switching is so unnoticeable though, it may be hard to tell even after your tutorial! I read your post about Aftermath and you made some very good points. You said, "We are used to hearing Adam do acoustic Aftermath a la the GNT arragement, which keeps him in the light, sweet head voice when he sings "wanna scream out" and "in the aftermath" at the beginning. Last night, he powered those phrases out and added a bit of rasp to them, as we all heard. More importantly, he changed the first "wanna scream out" around 1:00 minute in from its usual lighter, higher tone to being slightly belted out. But he was not flat; if you're used to the GNT version it may sound a little off simply because he didn't use the same tone to achieve the notes. Also, "just remember" at approx. 1:18 is slightly belted, which is in contrast to how he usually sings it in his lighter tone. In fact, he's not even trying to hit the higher notes and falling flat, he's going for decidedly lower notes. Which also makes it sound different. Also, the acapella run was fucking fabulous - that's how you do it! I liked the quick transition right afterwards - he extended that run maybe a bit longer than he meant to but I love the way it turned out and how sweetly he ended the song. He had to trim the song down time-wise too, normally he doesn't have to jump right back into the next verse after he does that run but I thought he executed it beautifully." I agree that much of the difference we heard was because Adam was not shifting into his light head voice in places we are used to in Acoustic Aftermath. The belting you refer to is Adam using his chest voice on those notes, or possibly the chest with a little of the brightness of his head voice mixed in. I wrote on Monday when I returned: "Trying to pull me into the debate? Was he singing flat? Was he right on? Well, at the risk of being kicked off right after coming back, I am on the "it's a little pitchy" side. The first phrase he bobbled a little on "lost", and in the next phrase, was a bit flat on the next to bottom note. Sorry. Having said that, after about the first minute he found his footing and delivered a beautiful rendition. It was tender in parts, full power in others, and so present in sound and in appearance. He was singing directly to the audience and the camera. It incorporated his beautiful melodic voice, and his rock edge --- and, as is always the case with Adam, there was emotion and purpose to his shadings and colors. I never got the impression that he was singing to impress us with his voice -- as is so prevalent in the contestants this year, IMO. He surrendered himself to the song and the message with confidence and talent." Going back and listening to it again, my ear hears the B4 on "SCREAM out" and "reMEMber" as a little flat the first time through, whereas you do not. However, at the 1"52 mark where the phrase comes around again, he hits the B4 perfectly, using his chest voice with a little grit. Nica asked me: "thank you, cassie, I think many of us noticed the wobly first couple of sounds... Do you think his raspiness was intentional?" I replied, "Oh, absolutely! I heard nothing that would lead me to think it was anything but stylistic. We are used to the acoustic version where he switches into his light head voice for the top notes, keeping it delicate. In this version, he didn't make that switch. He powered those notes and roughened them up. There was rasp, but there was not strain in his body or in the notes. Wouldn't want him to do that routinely, as it is tough on the cords, but, it added grit to the performance here. Elsewhere in the song, the pure, clear vocals were very present. " You and I were hearing the same change in the version, using chest instead of head voice. As to more details about the difference in voices, it's obvious you do hear it, but I will take some time later today or tomorrow to do a more analytical response for you with examples. Like you said, with Adam, it is hard for me, and many others, to tell what voice he is using. He is that good! |
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Post by fiercelier on Mar 19, 2011 11:41:45 GMT -5
musicgirl: Thanks for posting those youtubes of your native folk music. There is something beautiful and moving about male voices together in a cappella harmony, isn't there? You find such groups in so many genres and cultures. Here in the US we used to have barbershop quartets who sang in those close harmonies with no accompaniment. Not many are still doing it, but male a cappella singing re-emerges every generation, it seems. There have been college male singing groups and fraternity singing groups from way back when, too. The boy bands of the '80s were another incarnation. Today we have the urban beat box style. I enjoy this example of male a cappella singing (from Sweden): There is a singing competion on TV in December called the Sing-Off. We watched it last year, which was the second year it was held, and it will be back in December of this year again. A gospel group from Alabama called Committed won the competion and are now recording an album. Our particular favorites were a group out of Nashville called Street Corner Symphoney. Some of the groups were mixed, and different styles as well, so you might like to check that out this year. Really beautiful singing, which I'm finding so often not the case, post-Adam. I guess we are just so spoiled! www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYyJ0YT087A |
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Post by algalhi on Mar 19, 2011 13:35:18 GMT -5
Since we're talking about Adam's AI10 Aftermath performance, I wanted to say that I noticed how clearly he sang and I could understand every word. That was so important, since he wanted to convey his message to everyone, especially those feeling down and hopeless. By contrast, I understood almost nothing that Diddy sang!
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Post by cassie on Mar 19, 2011 13:41:22 GMT -5
I am looking for Adam things to do to avoid grading papers. So, warning of long-ass post. I’ll try to tackle the question of Adam’s use of chest and head voice. But, let me say at the outset that Adam does such a superb job of blending the sounds of his different registers that I am not expert enough to always know which voice he is using. Plus, I am not a professional singer or voice teacher, so be gentle.
What is all this stuff about chest and head and mixed registers? It’s about how and where a note resonates in the human body. The vocal cords create a pitch by tightening or loosening to control how fast or slow the cords vibrate. (Remember that sound is caused by something vibrating in a frequency that the ear hears.) Human vocal cords (or folds) are typically between a half inch and an inch in length. Men have longer, thicker cords than women (usually) and that causes their pitch to be lower, just like longer, thicker guitar strings produce lower notes.
So, if the cords are so small, and are buried in the throat, how do they make such rich, loud tones? The vibrations travel in the body and bounce around the air cavities in the chest, mouth, nose and sinuses. (They also vibrate the bones and tissues in the body to a lesser extent, but forget that for this discussion.) When you speak, the tone resonates or bounces around mainly in your chest. Chest voice. However, when you squeal a high “eeeek” at seeing a mouse, you are shifting the resonance out of your chest into your facial bones and sinuses (head voice).
Give it a try. Put your hand on your upper breast bone and talk in your low, powerful voice. You can feel the vibrations. Now, squeal “eeeeeeeek” with your hand still in place. You should not feel any vibration in your hand.
When people without formal training sing, they usually sing primarily using that chest resonance or vibration. It sounds full and rich (hopefully) and is used to sing the lower notes. With coaching, training and practice, the singer can learn to shift that resonance out of the chest and into the head. Done correctly, the sound will be higher in pitch, different in tone, but still full and ringing, not strained. Done less skillfully, they may be able to shift to the higher notes, but the sound is weak and possibly breathy.
One’s anatomy and physiology basically determine how low one can sing, and how high one can sing with chest resonance. As you sing a scale (do, re, mi, fa, so) from your lowest notes to your highest notes you probably reach a point where you are tightening your throat muscles and pushing the breath forcefully to produce the note. Congratulations, you are belting. That’s the top of your possible chest voice. (And probably higher than you ought to try to sing because you can damage your vocal cords with that tension and push.)
If you want to go higher, you will have to shift the resonance into your head, skull, sinuses. Voile! Head voice. (Maybe not such a good head voice if you don’t have training, but a head voice none the less.) How do you make that head voice sound great? It’s about minute muscle control throughout your body. It’s also about getting a good coach!
The area where you start to strain or push for high notes is where your “natural break” is for your voice. It’s where a singer will normally flip into head voice. So, where is Adam’s natural break? I hear it most often at around a G above middle C, typical for a tenor. We have all heard it in the Idol “Mad World.” “Went to school and I was very ne ER vous”. He flips into his head voice for that G, and he does it noticeably and intentionally, to emphasize the meaning of the word. You also hear it in the iheart radio Sleepwalker at the beginning. “I saw a PICTURE OF you….. I heard a VOICE THAT I knew….it took me BACK TO THE end”. Some folks say they prefer the GNT Sleepwalker because it sounds less tentative and stronger at the beginning. That is partially because the key was lowered a step so he could hit those top notes at the beginning softly, but still in his chest voice.
Though the G4 seems like a natural break in Adam’s voice, his speaking voice/chest voice is actually quite high.
Remember Milan's IIHY? When Adam is yelling at the girls to say they are sorry and to hug, his speaking voice hits about a C#5. In the intro of DTRH on the GNT CD “motherFUCKers” actually hits almost the E5, or E an octave plus above middle C. Because of this naturally high voice, when Adam wants power instead of tenderness on high notes, he can stay in his chest register while adding a bit of head voice ring (blending registers) up to the D5 or E5. You hear it as the powerful high notes, such as the high D5 at the peak of the live “Feeling Good.”
In Mad World, he also uses his chest voice/head blend as he builds the song, “look right thruuuuuu me. And I find it….” In Sleepwalker version above he uses it for “walker, walker, walker, I’m a sleepwalker” at 1:35.
If you want further examples of the sound of Adam in chest vs head voice, listen to Acoustic Live Aftermath. Here is my amateur analysis of the voices he uses in it. CAPS are light head voice. Bold are notes above his natural break using chest voice for power with a blend of head resonance/ringing.
Have you lost your way?
Livin' in the shadow of the messes that you made
And so it goes
Everything inside your circle starts to overflow
Take a step before you leap
Into the colours that you seek
You'll get back what you give away
So don't look back on yesterday
Wanna SCREAM OUT
No more hiding
Don't be afraid of what's inside
Gonna TELL YA you'll be alright
IN THE AFTERMATH
Anytime anybody pulls you down
Anytime anybody says you're not allowed
Just reMEMBER you are not alone
In the Aftermath
You feel the weight
Of lies and contradictions that you live with every day
It's not too late
Think of what can be if you rewrite the role you play
Take a step before you leap
Into the colours that you seek
You give back what you give away
So don't look back on yesterday
Wanna SCREAM OUT
No more hiding
Don't be afraid of what's inside
Gonna TELL YA you'll be alright
IN THE AFTERMATH
Anytime anybody pulls you down
Anytime anybody says you're NOT ALLowed
Just REMEMBER you are not alone
In the Aftermath
In the Aftermath
Before you break you have to shed your armor
Take a trip and fall into the glitter
Tell a stranger that they're beautiful
So all you feel is love, love
All you feel is love
Wanna scream out
No more hiding
Don't be afraid of what's inside
Wanna tell you you'll be alright
In the Aftermath
Anytime anybody pulls you down
Anytime anybody says you're not allowed
Just REMEMBER you are not alone
In the Aftermath
In the Aftermath
You are not aLONE
You are NOT alone
Wanna scream out no more hiding
Wanna scream out NO MORE HIDING
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Post by mszue on Mar 19, 2011 14:36:35 GMT -5
musicgirl: Thanks for posting those youtubes of your native folk music. There is something beautiful and moving about male voices together in a cappella harmony, isn't there? You find such groups in so many genres and cultures. Here in the US we used to have barbershop quartets who sang in those close harmonies with no accompaniment. Not many are still doing it, but male a cappella singing re-emerges every generation, it seems. There have been college male singing groups and fraternity singing groups from way back when, too. The boy bands of the '80s were another incarnation. Today we have the urban beat box style. I enjoy this example of male a cappella singing (from Sweden): Hi Cassie and all I wanted to make a couple of comments on the vid above: That is really really good a capella singing...very high degree of difficulty. I sang barbershop with the Sweet Adelines for a few years and it is much harder to do those 'beat' bum bum bum's than you would imagine...they are much harder than singing the melody! And they had the full 4 parts there....really good. There are still quite a few barbershop groups ranging from the classic quartets to the more common/popular choruses .... and of course, including the female SAI singers. There are competitions yearly, throughout the world. They just don't get a lot of press....but some groups are really good. I wanted to comment also on the Aussie singer....I too love this kind of voice. Sarah Brightman used to sound much like this...perhaps a bit brighter but she still had that lightness. She seems to have darkened up a bit with age, I suppose. And that brings me to my second question: You commented some time back on the young girl that came in 2nd on AGT...Evanko [?] and related the dangers of singing ahead of your time, and you used Charlotte Church as your example. The Pie Jesu here is sung by the girl when she is just 15. Is she endangering her voice this way? So many young singers are burned out by 30 and you never hear from them again....it is a shame when that happens... If a rock singer does that to themself as an adult...that is their issue [beware, Harm Principle in action] but when it is a young person I am more concerned. Finally....just a comment, not meant to aggravate. I am really glad we have this thread here so that it is possible to acknowledge minute events in Adam's singing in a way that does not leave us in danger of being called out as 'bad' fans...or even non-fans...which is what was happening to the 2 or 3 who suggested that the first few notes...especially 3rd beat...was wobbly and off on the AI aftermath. If he was...or anybody was...100% perfect, 100% of the time, eventually, it would cease to be worthwhile even checking in...it might actually even get boring.....oops...tmi? running for the sofa here..... TRUST ME....I adore Adam and truly believe, no..I know...he has one of the most amazing voices around....bar none. |
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pjd
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Post by pjd on Mar 19, 2011 15:17:33 GMT -5
Catzmadam - I wanted to thank you again for posting those youtubes of Hayley Westenra. I really, really like her voice. (cassie - like you, that is exactly the beautiful pure soprano sound I love) I checked iTunes and Amazon here and was able to find a bunch of her stuff, but not the Pie Jesu :( Sorta sad about that since it is my very favorite piece by Lloyd Weber. (mszue mentioned that her voice was like Sarah Brightman's. This piece was certainly written originally for Sarah, but I actually like Hayley's version here a little better than the recording I have of Sarah.)
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Alison
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Post by Alison on Mar 19, 2011 16:50:19 GMT -5
Finally....just a comment, not meant to aggravate. I am really glad we have this thread here so that it is possible to acknowledge minute events in Adam's singing in a way that does not leave us in danger of being called out as 'bad' fans...or even non-fans...which is what was happening to the 2 or 3 who suggested that the first few notes...especially 3rd beat...was wobbly and off on the AI aftermath. If he was...or anybody was...100% perfect, 100% of the time, eventually, it would cease to be worthwhile even checking in...it might actually even get boring.....oops...tmi? running for the sofa here..... TRUST ME....I adore Adam and truly believe, no..I know...he has one of the most amazing voices around....bar none. I agree Mszue, it is in the rare examples of imperfections in Adam's performances that we find proof of his impeccable talent, skill, training. With most singers I find myself trying to pick out the good notes. Adam is a joy to listen to because I find myself taken by surprise when he is ever so slightly off. This only brings him back down to earth to me--reminds me that he wasn't born this way--he is not an alien. He is a man whose talent was heightened by years of training and a drive for perfection. His imperfections make him even more remarkable to me. I felt like my evaluation of AI's Aftermath was viewed negatively by others. I even started to doubt myself but ultimately decided to back away for a while because I know what I heard and I know I am a "good" fan. I just don't have the words to express what I am hearing and this is why I appreciate this thread so much. Cassie, thank you for the teaching you do here. |
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