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Post by cassie on Oct 4, 2011 22:34:56 GMT -5
Just guessing here. But, I would think: 1. Absolute vocal rest except for performance. 2. Decongestants to help clear away the mucus in his throat and head. 3. Vaporizer/humidifier to mechanically do the same. 4. Steroids to decrease the swelling of tissues. (NOT a long term solution, but helpful if the singer also does #5) 5. Adjusting the way he sings, the amount of glory notes, taking the melody down instead of up, easing off on some virtuoso riffs. (All of which I think he did that night) 6. Hydrating, hydrating, hydrating during the performance, with water and soothing, aromatic teas and honey. <snip> How is it that Adele has had such trouble with her voice, and Adam sang 110+ shows and sounded better at the end than at the beginning? It is not luck. It is not the voice he was born with. His cords are not naturally more durable. It is his familiarity with his voice, with his technique, with his limits, with how to approach the low, mid-range and high notes. Adele has this sexy sounding, husky, chesty voice. It almost always sounds to me like she is pushing her voice. Straining to sing the notes. That most likely means she doesn't know about proper technique. Adam never sounds like he is straining or pushing his voice. THAT is because of the extensive training on how to use it properly. How to find the maximum resonance for each tone. How to support it properly thru breathing. He knows when to shift into chest voice, when to shift into head voice, when to shift into falsetto, so he can hit each note in the range without strain on the muscles or the cords. And, that ain't easy. I don't know many, or, frankly any people who have learned that without formal training. It's just not something easily discovered by accident. <snip> Adam also was smart enough to lower the keys of many of his songs so that there was less stress on his voice going for the glory notes. He also knew when to skip the glory notes if his voice was not feeling "right" that performance. He takes very good care of his instrument. Thank goodness. <snip> But, without the training he received he would not know how to use that physiology properly, how to access the resonance, how to shape the tone, how to put a little gravel or buzz into the sound without straining the cords. Hmmmm, cassie, based on what you wrote above, do you think Adele COULD adjust her technique enough to preserve her voice without sacrificing her "sound"? That "push the wretched heartbreak" gravel is what (IMO) makes Adele sound like Adele. Would she sound signficantly different if she sang a different way? Also, why wasn't someone like Louis Armstrong - who to me is the epitomy of the "gravelly" singer - affected by the way he sang? Louis.... maybe his singing was gravelly because he had damaged his voice???? Or, maybe, he played his HeWhoCannot amedet more than he sang? Not familiar enuf to say for sure. As for Adele.... you have an excellent point. Certainly she could learn techniques to protect her voice and sing without straining. But, it would most probably not sound like Adele. It is that "push" at the top of her range where her voice almost cracks that seems to give such power and emotion to her interpretation. The thing is, she has a rich, warm lower register when she doesn't push, and when she flips into her head voice at the top (you can clearly hear it, as the tone is much lighter and more delicate) there is a very nice quality to it. She has the basics. I think she has the potential to have very good voice singing "legitimately" or "correctly". But, it would be a different voice than what she uses now.
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Post by SusieFierce on Oct 4, 2011 22:37:20 GMT -5
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Post by wal on Oct 4, 2011 22:40:18 GMT -5
Pictures of Adam and Neil.
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Post by Q3 on Oct 4, 2011 22:43:54 GMT -5
I never saw that macro before!! Too funny,
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2011 22:51:36 GMT -5
Thought you all might enjoy part of Lyndsey's recap of WWFM from The Singoff last night. Already one of the most promising crews of the first bracket, this all-girl allstar team comprising former "Sing-Off" contestants stepped it up even higher on their first, modern song, a beautiful and hauntingly arranged rendition of the aforementioned Adam Lambert's "Whataya Want From Me." Starting with just one vocalist, alone onstage under a single spotlight, the song grew, layer by layer and singer by singer, until all of the Delilah girls were onstage for the song's dramatic chorus. The effect was powerful, and as their soaring vocals blended, their rendition owed as much to the more feminine original by Pink as it did to Adam's famous version. And might I add...this is not an easy song to sing. (I know. I've tried it in karaoke, against my better judgment[/b] new.music.yahoo.com/blogs/realityrocks/422758/episode-3-recap-the-sing-off-is-way-off/
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Post by momtomany on Oct 4, 2011 22:51:57 GMT -5
At the risk of really being a bore at the end of the thread, here's a little bit about Adele and vocal cords and hemorrhages and Adam, too.
The Tigers are losing and I can't bear it so I'm coming here.
I've been singing for longer than most Atopians have been alive - I have to admit that. For many years I didn't do it right. I knew it was 'wrong' as I sang; because I'd almost have to literally 'stick my neck out' to reach the notes I wanted to hit. That's why it's painful to me to watch the calisthenics OLFIP does when singing 'all out'. Sometimes hitting the high notes would almost hurt. Then I met a voice teacher who told me to place my voice in my forehead. I thought she was a little beyond her years! How could I take the 'voice box' in my throat and make it seem like it was in the front of my head?
It didn't happen at once. But, given a few more years of (vocal?) maturity, I found that the pure voice comes from not listening to the sound you make; not manufacturing the sound; giving yourself a huge reservoir of air to control, and then just letting the sound be free. It really does move - from the throat to the head - and the pure voice of song HAS NO PHYSICAL FEELING.
Believe me, singing in the shower really has its merits. When you can't hear yourself, you allow your voice to be placed where it should be.
I listen to Adele and her unique voice. I can hear when she is working her sound, and when she is letting her voice escape into her head. Her free, head voice is beautiful - and without the rasp and emotion she conveys most of the time. Her vocal cord 'hemorrhage', in my medical opinion (and medicine is my career), is a result of too much pressure exerted, over time, on the fragile and not-so-fragile vasculature of the vocal cords. Hemorrhoids result when we try to poop too hard (thank you for the lyrics to a new song this morning!) and vocal cord hemorrhages occur when the straining becomes so great that a vessel will 'pop' - creating an internal bruise and temporary bulging or swelling of tissue, and an inability for the voicebox to vibrate congruently - resulting in hoarseness or complete loss of voice.
Smoking will exacerbate or enhance - smoking increases the pressure exerted on arteries and veins; even without straining for a high note.
I am not an opera singer; certainly not a vocalist of renown; but I have come far enough to have learned a secret. Once a vocalist has freed the voice so it resides 'in your head', the task becomes one of breath control. That's how you learn to sustain notes; soar and wail, or bring the pianissimo longing into the interpretation of song - - convey richness, fullness, roundness and complexity; or the 'unbearable lightness of being'.
Adam knows where his voice belongs. I don't know how he made it happen at Nokia "when he had nothing". But, I would venture to say it had a lot to do with 'no talking', lots of tea and honey and lemon, no sustained high notes, lots of dancing (good distraction!) and a clever use of the background tracks that accompanied him. And determination and faith in the Universe. If he had stopped, midway through, and said "I have nothing" - we would have understood. Adam knew that; and it was enough - that faith and that knowledge - to seal a great effort and a great performance.
Tell me - - why do I love this man?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2011 23:01:04 GMT -5
Beautiful and enlightening post, momtomany! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) I know nothing about singing technique, but I think I have a very good sense of common sense and I am very logical. And my common sense and logic tells me that if someone does 117 concerts all over the world over a 6 month time period and sounds better in the last one, than they did in the first one, then.... "They must be doing something right!"
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Post by readon on Oct 4, 2011 23:04:49 GMT -5
At the risk of really being a bore at the end of the thread, here's a little bit about Adele and vocal cords and hemorrhages and Adam, too. The Tigers are losing and I can't bear it so I'm coming here. I've been singing for longer than most Atopians have been alive - I have to admit that. For many years I didn't do it right. I knew it was 'wrong' as I sang; because I'd almost have to literally 'stick my neck out' to reach the notes I wanted to hit. That's why it's painful to me to watch the calisthenics OLFIP does when singing 'all out'. Sometimes hitting the high notes would almost hurt. Then I met a voice teacher who told me to place my voice in my forehead. I thought she was a little beyond her years! How could I take the 'voice box' in my throat and make it seem like it was in the front of my head? It didn't happen at once. But, given a few more years of (vocal?) maturity, I found that the pure voice comes from not listening to the sound you make; not manufacturing the sound; giving yourself a huge reservoir of air to control, and then just letting the sound be free. It really does move - from the throat to the head - and the pure voice of song HAS NO PHYSICAL FEELING. Believe me, singing in the shower really has its merits. When you can't hear yourself, you allow your voice to be placed where it should be. I listen to Adele and her unique voice. I can hear when she is working her sound, and when she is letting her voice escape into her head. Her free, head voice is beautiful - and without the rasp and emotion she conveys most of the time. Her vocal cord 'hemorrhage', in my medical opinion (and medicine is my career), is a result of too much pressure exerted, over time, on the fragile and not-so-fragile vasculature of the vocal cords. Hemorrhoids result when we try to poop too hard (thank you for the lyrics to a new song this morning!) and vocal cord hemorrhages occur when the straining becomes so great that a vessel will 'pop' - creating an internal bruise and temporary bulging or swelling of tissue, and an inability for the voicebox to vibrate congruently - resulting in hoarseness or complete loss of voice. Smoking will exacerbate or enhance - smoking increases the pressure exerted on arteries and veins; even without straining for a high note. I am not an opera singer; certainly not a vocalist of renown; but I have come far enough to have learned a secret. Once a vocalist has freed the voice so it resides 'in your head', the task becomes one of breath control. That's how you learn to sustain notes; soar and wail, or bring the pianissimo longing into the interpretation of song - - convey richness, fullness, roundness and complexity; or the 'unbearable lightness of being'. Adam knows where his voice belongs. I don't know how he made it happen at Nokia "when he had nothing". But, I would venture to say it had a lot to do with 'no talking', lots of tea and honey and lemon, no sustained high notes, lots of dancing (good distraction!) and a clever use of the background tracks that accompanied him. And determination and faith in the Universe. If he had stopped, midway through, and said "I have nothing" - we would have understood. Adam knew that; and it was enough - that faith and that knowledge - to seal a great effort and a great performance. Tell me - - why do I love this man? I understood when Adele's blogs was posted. I got the technical gist of it when Cassie posted. I really really... really got it with your post. Momtomany, when you post i just always want to say Tetisfy, Preach... Back to lurking.
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Post by Craazyforadam on Oct 4, 2011 23:56:00 GMT -5
I have to come back to the topic of Adam's band, because while I have weaved my way through this thread tonight, I have to say that I am seeing things a bit differently.
Musically, I think it does matter. It matters what Adam decides to do or wants to do and while he is the one who gets to make the choices, ultimately there are consequences depending on which way he goes.
Yes, Adam has for now decided to operate as a solo vocalist with a backing band. And in that context all parties of that backing band are in principle exchangeable. True. But the musical quality you get with that approach is just not the same as in other scenarios. Even when individual players are as technically skilled as Monte is, the sound will somewhat vary with different parties involved and you will never get the tightness of a band that you get when great players form a band and stay together and together strive for the same musical excellence at that top level that Adam himself is at.
For me in group performances tightness is something that I very much notice, more so than perhaps individual ability or arrangement or other aspects. There is something about striving for excellence that comes through in the way a group operates together.
First and foremost, a group needs to actually want it. If a group does not feel itself as a complete entity, they don't tend to develop this kind of desire. They are just a supporting act who each deliver their contribution. Of course, they also need to be mega talented individuals, but first and foremost they actually need to have a desire to perform as ONE, a backing band typically does not.
My observation was that the only person in Adam's 'band' who ever had that desire in him, was Longineu and I think he left not because he did not get along with Adam musically, in fact the two did just fine, but ultimately Longineu could not find what he was looking for and left for a committed band. And I bet he is struggling there too, because in Yellowcard he is not surrounded by enough quality players either, imo. He to me was always the best of the bunch.
The way Adam is raving about somebody like Pharrell or has always praised Longineu's ability to be instinctively in sync with him during performances just shows me that Adam inertly loves the music enough that he can smell the talent on the other side and is drawn to it when he finds somebody who is on the same level and things just click. With just hiring the session help or the tour help, he will not find that. And I think somewhere he is longing for more.
Does Monte long for more? Maybe on a personal level, yes, but I am not totally convinced. I don't know, whether he thinks he can develop his musical vision in cooperation with Adam or whether Adam's music gives Monte what he is looking to play. Neither does obviously Madonna, Adam would be of course closer to such a vision than she is. But does Monte strive to lead a team to greatness? I don't know that I am seeing that from him.
By the way: All GREAT bands have this tightness that creates magic. Right now, Muse has it, big time for example. And look where they are. And rock bands all across the board, from Queen on one end to somebody like Metallica on the other, there is an IT-factor within a band before you ever discuss vocals. If the right people get together, magic happens, but that cannot happen, if it is just a backing band.
So, Adam is making his choices here, it does matter. Now as far as the rest of the band, here is what I think. Cam to me is a better songwriter than she is a keyboard player. Her interpretive range on the piano / keys seems limited and with Soaked she would have had the chance to show more. That song was written with Muse's brilliant pianist in mind. It allows for some nice sophistication and variation of style. Did not ever see that from her. Zac showed us more and he is not even a professional keyboard player by background, Lisa of course showed more too, but I do agree that she may have not quite fit in other ways.
Tommy seems very versatile, between guitar, keys and bass he has quite a range of options and obviously he has brought other elements to the whole team, even though those days are probably over. I am a bit undecided in my opinion on how far Tommy could go, I always think he needs somebody to pull him, then he could rise to any occasion, but perhaps he does not have the drive or does not see where he could go next. I think though that he is a better player than many in the Adam fandom gave him credit for. And Isaac, well, to me he was no Longineu. Nice guy, though, but I did not see anywhere the same skill level and variety and initiative or inert rhythmic sensibility. A drummer to me must live and breathe through his instruments and I just never got that from him.
So if Adam can feel that, when will he want to surround himself with a team of his own caliber, or does he not want that? Right now, I think he is happy where he is at, but I think in the future that question may be before him again and again and he will have to decide what he wants to do. But I do think that the decision he makes is of importance and makes a difference.
And of course I understand all personal decisions that may go into any of this. It is not easy to get a stable team together under any circumstance. Adam will have to figure this out at least for this next round.
YMMV.
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Post by stardust on Oct 5, 2011 0:21:11 GMT -5
Ahhh, Craazyforadam. You have some good points there that I hadn't considered. Several problems occur to me. Adam is signed as a solo artist and 19 probably would not let him be part of a band. Also, pop stars are generally solo artists.
Both Monte and Tommy seem to prefer rock/heavy metal if left to their own choices. That may mean that Adam's music is not their preference and I wonder if that makes a difference in their willingness to go all out, especially if they have no ownership of the band. Interesting questions.
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