JazzRocks
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The Crazy Train is Ready to Roll!
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Post by JazzRocks on Jun 17, 2012 7:22:38 GMT -5
Not caught up here - wow this thread is taking off! When I do get caught up I may have more to say, but for now:
Yes this is a concern. And something we're not accustomed to as most GNT concerts were sold out early iirc. The first one this era that surprised me was Wilkes Barre...not sold out. And what a show that turned out to be!
Btw - I don't think Adam's music is necessarily too good for pop radio or too sophisticated for young pop fans. I was speaking specifically about Shady which I think IS more sophisticated musically and also a bit retro. At least it sounds that way to me. I could be completely wrong about this - my own experience is quite the opposite as I liked standards and jazz and show tunes and semi-classical music when I was a teen. (In addition to pop I might add)
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Post by nica575 on Jun 17, 2012 8:46:44 GMT -5
Not caught up here - wow this thread is taking off! When I do get caught up I may have more to say, but for now: Yes this is a concern. And something we're not accustomed to as most GNT concerts were sold out early iirc. The first one this era that surprised me was Wilkes Barre...not sold out. And what a show that turned out to be! Btw - I don't think Adam's music is necessarily too good for pop radio or too sophisticated for young pop fans. I was speaking specifically about Shady which I think IS more sophisticated musically and also a bit retro. At least it sounds that way to me. I could be completely wrong about this - my own experience is quite the opposite as I liked standards and jazz and show tunes and semi-classical music when I was a teen. (In addition to pop I might add) ... in the meantime the Bieb's whole tour sold out in 30 mins. I understand that probably most of it went to re-sellers - but in any case it is an indication of public demand....IMO - masses are totally brainless - exactly as NCOE MV depicted... and Adam is trying to show what the real colors of singing are.... glampoon - a question to you: you said you like Biebs... IDK if you were joking about it or not, but if you were serious - can you please tell me what you like about him on the music/singing side? I really value your opinion (I can see that he is rather cute and looks sweet).
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Post by lambo on Jun 17, 2012 8:49:37 GMT -5
glampoon - a question to you: you said you like Biebs... IDK if you were joking about it or not, but if you were serious - can you please tell me what you like about him on the music/singing side? I really value your opinion (I can see that he is rather cute and looks sweet). I just think his songs sound good, simple as that I do think he has a good voice. Sure he's not Adam-tier but it's more than good enough for his music
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2012 8:52:45 GMT -5
I have a reason for the not sold out FS and CM. First CM is a very large venue, 8500. As of right now, a month before the show, 4500 tickets have been sold. If Adam can sell out venues of 4500 for the rest of his life, he will be making a very nice living. 2) I thought WB was sold out and only resale tickets were available? 3) CM and FS are too close together in both distance and days. Non stans are not going to go to both concerts, no way! So they are choosing one. These 2 shows are basically cannibalizing each other. One big show, like Nokia, IMO would have sold out. But that would have been an expensive endeavor. Pretty sure CM and FS are paying Adam well. Adam's job is to bring people to these places for other reasons than the concert. It works because there is no way in hell I'd be going to the Fair otherwise! So now, besides the concert ticket, they've got me for probably at least $20 worth of food and some other nonsense Fair merchandise I will probably end up buying!
^^Probably not a dark post, sorry! ^^ :-/
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Post by nica575 on Jun 17, 2012 9:38:39 GMT -5
glampoon - a question to you: you said you like Biebs... IDK if you were joking about it or not, but if you were serious - can you please tell me what you like about him on the music/singing side? I really value your opinion (I can see that he is rather cute and looks sweet). I just think his songs sound good, simple as that I do think he has a good voice. Sure he's not Adam-tier but it's more than good enough for his music see... sounds dismissing to me... have you heard him lately and live? ... (and yes, I am using the same expression as Adam used ;D...) mys*&@^#r - there are really not that many "dark" posts here ... I totally agree that these events are money making for Adam (with no risk) and of course are beneficial for the organizers (otherwise they would not be inviting him). They sell rooms,drinks, people gamble, or buy hot dogs and water...whatever... that is not what I am looking at... the thing is that both Adam and his team might be using these to gauge the viability of the tour - at least the US leg. I suppose selling say 80% is not bad...or may be they will go for mid-size venues again (would be great for us and bad for Adam). also, he is invited back because he sold out last time...well, may be the Queen related press will help...
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Post by jean1010 on Jun 17, 2012 11:14:08 GMT -5
Brand new here today. I have been lurking here for a few weeks. I post a little at MJs but felt I would like to visit a more supportive place. I am a natural born worrywart so I think this will be the thread for me. I am a little sad to see we are talking about the meaning of success and the meme that "he is making a living doing what he loves" that we have so recently heard from Cook fans and before that Archie's etc. Of course, that is all true, and it is also true that those who arrive at the summit of fame often have very troubles lives as MJ and Whitney have sadly illustrated. But I am blue right now anyway. Sorry to be a downer on my very first post. I am going to try to have faith that Adam with his many, many personal gifts will arrive at the place that he wants to be in this ever so difficult business.
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Post by midwifespal on Jun 17, 2012 11:21:43 GMT -5
ETA: I see, having posted before catching up on the thread (bad MWP) that the conversation has mostly moved on from radio. I'm sorry for always dragging the thread around by its tail, backwards. I'll try to be better about that. Feel free to scroll away!Hiya, rabbitrabbit! Nice to see you posting here! I don't think Adam's album is particularly deeper or more adult or sophisticated in subject matter than many of of the songs that have been in the Top 40 over the last year, or some other pop albums released in the past few years and I LOVE Trespassing and think it is an amazing album. I'm glad you said that. At the risk of ducking tomatoes, I think Adam is a very smart, very interesting, thoughtful, articulate person, but I don't love his music for the depth and sophistication of its lyrics. I love it for its sense of fun (and of other emotions) and its wit, and its rhythm, and its charm, and sexiness, and variety, and surprises, and of course his voice and delivery and musical sense, etc, etc. I do think the lyrics are good, and frequently clever, and often (though not always) show strength in restraint and simplicity (which Adam has himself talked about when describing his evolution as a lyricist), and he's not averse to taking the odd lyrical risk, but he is somewhat lyrically limited by his genre. I don't think the rest of the music in mainstream pop is hugely lyrically sophisticated either. That's not a knock on either Adam or pop. Pop is meant to be accessible and catchy (i.e. popular)--two perfectly noble goals that enable pop's wonderful trick of taking us out of ourselves--and just like other mainstream pop writers Adam, I'm sure happily, makes various lyrical choices in order to secure those ends. Which is great. Pop music isn't about describing unique personal experience in subtle and idiosyncratic terms--as Adam himself has said many times, it's about paring down those personal experiences into a more generally relateable experience in terms that a wide range of listeners can quickly catch onto emotionally. That is pop's strength, and it is a considerable strength. And I recognize, I hasten to add, that there are many more ways than one to be sophisticated. Really subtle lyrics are by no means the only path to emotional thoughtfulness. That said, I do agree with bullsfan that a lot of mainstream pop right now skews very young, and that the more adult themes in a lot of Adam's music are more sophisticated than that. I find his lyrics much more compelling than Bruno Mars' singles (I know his album ventures into more complex territory) or the two One Direction song's I've heard on the radio (unlike these two acts, Bieber's music, from what I've heard, seems to be less about lyrics and more about musical rhythms, etc, which gives it more legs for me). Frankly, I have outgrown the appeal of "you are so so beautiful and perfect" in a love song. As, of course, has Adam (#soimperfectlywhatyoushouldbe #scarsmakeuswhoweare). ------ Mika, I'm ashamed to admit it (what kind of English major am I?) but I've never actually read all of Ulysses. I needed help from my friendly neighborhood google to place, or re-place, your beautifully affirmative quote. But it immediately made me think of this, which I will always love: It's an ungainly and blatant yank back on topic, I'm afraid, but I do think Adam is awfully good at "proclaiming the eternal yes." And he is also, of course, a buon uomo. ----------------- On another personal note, I'm off today to LONDON! Maybe some of you remember that last summer I was supposed to go but my trip was sabotaged by the Fever Disease From Hell (FDFH)? This is my make-up trip, to see family in London and Germany. I'll give Adam an Sauli a great big Atop hug if I see them, okay? (promise: no neck sniffing/licking. Who'm I kidding? With my reticence the most I could manage is probably an awkwardly stuck out hand, lol. But I'll shake that hand like I REALLY MEAN IT ;D) Unfortunately I'll be back before July--timing just didn't work out for Queenbert. But I hope those of you going have a fantabulous time!
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Post by nica575 on Jun 17, 2012 12:56:42 GMT -5
ETA: I see, having posted before catching up on the thread (bad MWP) that the conversation has mostly moved on from radio. I'm sorry for always dragging the thread around by its tail, backwards. I'll try to be better about that. Feel free to scroll away!Hiya, rabbitrabbit! Nice to see you posting here! I don't think Adam's album is particularly deeper or more adult or sophisticated in subject matter than many of of the songs that have been in the Top 40 over the last year, or some other pop albums released in the past few years and I LOVE Trespassing and think it is an amazing album. I'm glad you said that. At the risk of ducking tomatoes, I think Adam is a very smart, very interesting, thoughtful, articulate person, but I don't love his music for the depth and sophistication of its lyrics. I love it for its sense of fun (and of other emotions) and its wit, and its rhythm, and its charm, and sexiness, and variety, and surprises, and of course his voice and delivery and musical sense, etc, etc. I do think the lyrics are good, and frequently clever, and often (though not always) show strength in restraint and simplicity (which Adam has himself talked about when describing his evolution as a lyricist), and he's not averse to taking the odd lyrical risk, but he is somewhat lyrically limited by his genre. I don't think the rest of the music in mainstream pop is hugely lyrically sophisticated either. That's not a knock on either Adam or pop. Pop is meant to be accessible and catchy (i.e. popular)--two perfectly noble goals that enable pop's wonderful trick of taking us out of ourselves--and just like other mainstream pop writers Adam, I'm sure happily, makes various lyrical choices in order to secure those ends. Which is great. Pop music isn't about describing unique personal experience in subtle and idiosyncratic terms--as Adam himself has said many times, it's about paring down those personal experiences into a more generally relateable experience in terms that a wide range of listeners can quickly catch onto emotionally. That is pop's strength, and it is a considerable strength. And I recognize, I hasten to add, that there are many more ways than one to be sophisticated. Really subtle lyrics are by no means the only path to emotional thoughtfulness. That said, I do agree with bullsfan that a lot of mainstream pop right now skews very young, and that the more adult themes in a lot of Adam's music are more sophisticated than that. I find his lyrics much more compelling than Bruno Mars' singles (I know his album ventures into more complex territory) or the two One Direction song's I've heard on the radio (unlike these two acts, Bieber's music, from what I've heard, seems to be less about lyrics and more about musical rhythms, etc, which gives it more legs for me). Frankly, I have outgrown the appeal of "you are so so beautiful and perfect" in a love song. As, of course, has Adam (#soimperfectlywhatyoushouldbe #scarsmakeuswhoweare). ------ Mika, I'm ashamed to admit it (what kind of English major am I?) but I've never actually read all of Ulysses. I needed help from my friendly neighborhood google to place, or re-place, your beautifully affirmative quote. But it immediately made me think of this, which I will always love: It's an ungainly and blatant yank back on topic, I'm afraid, but I do think Adam is awfully good at "proclaiming the eternal yes." And he is also, of course, a buon uomo. ----------------- On another personal note, I'm off today to LONDON! Maybe some of you remember that last summer I was supposed to go but my trip was sabotaged by the Fever Disease From Hell (FDFH)? This is my make-up trip, to see family in London and Germany. I'll give Adam an Sauli a great big Atop hug if I see them, okay? (promise: no neck sniffing/licking. Who'm I kidding? With my reticence the most I could manage is probably an awkwardly stuck out hand, lol. But I'll shake that hand like I REALLY MEAN IT ;D) Unfortunately I'll be back before July--timing just didn't work out for Queenbert. But I hope those of you going have a fantabulous time! mwp , have fun in London! Breath the same air! lyrics by Mr Lambert: I can't compare to pop today as I don't bother to listen... so I am taking Adam's songs in the context of my own perception, my own world (on the music side that means opera....)The result is: he has some shining moments IMO. Broken Open and OOL and Underneath (yes, with the "red river of screams") all have beauty of thought and emotion. BO especially can stand as a poetic piece in it's own right. Nirvana has great moments, as well as BE. I was intrigued to hear Adam speaking about the process of coming up with the lyrics...see, I always imagined that a song starts with lyrics and music is created FOR it. But it sounds like a song starts with a BEAT, and both lyrics and melody are mused out of some humming session, sort of slapped together at will...given the process I am not even sure how much lyrical sophistication can be expected from anyone.... I feel lucky in a way - I am so used to reacting to music only (from years of listening to operas in various languages) that I tend to ignore the lyrics at first and react to an overall musical emotion of a song. The words themselves are secondary for me...Adam is so expressive, with his voice, intonation, visual over the top expressiveness, that I can react with my soul, from the inside...I know what he is singing about, lyrics or no lyrics... for me - the so often criticized bridge in BE tells the whole story...
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Post by nica575 on Jun 17, 2012 13:44:24 GMT -5
Brand new here today. I have been lurking here for a few weeks. I post a little at MJs but felt I would like to visit a more supportive place. I am a natural born worrywart so I think this will be the thread for me. I am a little sad to see we are talking about the meaning of success and the meme that "he is making a living doing what he loves" that we have so recently heard from Cook fans and before that Archie's etc. Of course, that is all true, and it is also true that those who arrive at the summit of fame often have very troubles lives as MJ and Whitney have sadly illustrated. But I am blue right now anyway. Sorry to be a downer on my very first post. I am going to try to have faith that Adam with his many, many personal gifts will arrive at the place that he wants to be in this ever so difficult business. Hi jean! HUGE WELCOME to ATOP and to this wonderful thread! I was zen for a very long time but lately, with the BTIKM fiasco and the selection of the NCOE as the single a got into the blue zone as well.... NCOE killed me in a way... I perceive it as a mistake despite all the talk re radio format suitability and my own feeling that the song might not even matter, but politics does.... On the bright side - I DO believe that the talent of this magnitude cannot be denied and it will find its way to flourish and be recognized. Adam is so multifaceted, he is so much more than his voice...IMO here lies the biggest difference between Adam and anyone else on AI, including Archie and Cook. Something will happen to propel him into the radio land or whatever is needed... it is his air, he will not give it up! Please post!
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mika
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Post by mika on Jun 17, 2012 14:15:16 GMT -5
Brand new here today. I have been lurking here for a few weeks. I post a little at MJs but felt I would like to visit a more supportive place. I am a natural born worrywart so I think this will be the thread for me. I am a little sad to see we are talking about the meaning of success and the meme that "he is making a living doing what he loves" that we have so recently heard from Cook fans and before that Archie's etc. Of course, that is all true, and it is also true that those who arrive at the summit of fame often have very troubles lives as MJ and Whitney have sadly illustrated. But I am blue right now anyway. Sorry to be a downer on my very first post. I am going to try to have faith that Adam with his many, many personal gifts will arrive at the place that he wants to be in this ever so difficult business. Hi Jean, I don't know if this is the thread for you anymore, kiddo :-/, but, since it was until recently, let me welcome you. I think I understand what you are saying - feel like you're hearing the kind of consolation type remarks when people concede commercial success and then pooh-pooh it a bit? ('Well,' said Mom, 'it's being pretty on the inside that counts.' 'Wait! What, Mom?! I'm ugly?!! 'Don't worry dear - those other kids are just jealous anyway...' lol) I understand you feeling a bit bluesy, but don't take it too much to heart - fandom memes ebb and flow. I don't know how long you've been lurking but when I joined up one was likely to be gang jumped if one even suggested top of the pops wasn't VITAL to success - 'because IT"S WHAT ADAM WANTS' . A lot of tunes have ~changed with the times. I cannot predict the future, but I will tell you this based on current facts-- unless one was committed to Adam completely dominating the music scene w/his first album or in the two months after the release of his very well-received 2nd album -- there are excellent reasons to be enthusiastic about commercial success for this phase. I know, I know it's hard to wait but it really is too early to know 'what's next.' Just my opinion as a non Idol person, but try not to let those Idol memes get in your head. Cook put out a really not good second album (and I like him-I bought it and listened) and Archuleta has no place in current music scene. Again, jmo, but try, try to take Adam out of Idol-bubble in your head. (I went to MJs once and found it so foolish and small-spirited, I backed out with amazing speed.) Trespassing was given the attention reserved for recognized pop artists and Adam's now struggling in the high-octane waters of mainstream pop. And it's definitely tough out there (I'm still shaking my head that people are already kvetching about the performance of Usher's new album.) Also, try not to be too affected by fan 'expertise' (and I should really take my own advice ). People find comfort in armchair analysis because -like religion and political ideologies- it helps answer the unanswerable, lends order to the universe, and gives us something to hold to. So, my opinion fwiw - no funeral orations necessary just yet - 'we come not to bury Adam but to praise him'. I realize some level of anxiety may persist until there is a hit single or Trespassing moves back up chart, and that's okay. But try to release as much as you can, breathe deeply, meditate on the pretty and the music without guilt that you aren't 'doing more', and don't let the 'we didn't want silly old commercial success anyway' get you down. Everyone has different ways of dealing with anxiety - even when they're reluctant to admit it. This experience should be a joyful one - you've done what you can - let go and enjoy the ride. Finally, I promise you, if NCOE or next single becomes a big hit and Trespassing climbs charts, something else will become the focus of anxiety because we want Adam 'safe' -- it is a bit of a Siddhartha situation I think. ( Juniemoon had a great earlier note about Mayans, cosmic numbers and seeking reassurance the king would be well.) Of course, some are not anxious but just want to argue about something - always. <sigh>Ma lesh. In the recent past, I would have invited you somewhere nice and quiet but with manifest destiny or acquisitiveness or something - I can't find my way around anymore. I'll leave you a flower at the end though as a remembrance of dark, lovely nights. Please strongly consider posting a hello on the daily news thread if you haven't yet - you deserve an official welcome. Always need new faces. I think it's out with old blood like mine and in with the fresh! Be welcome, my friend
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