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Post by evamaria on Jul 16, 2012 11:31:02 GMT -5
This has been a difficult era for sure, but he is truly talented, and his peers, especially older, established peers like Slash, Queen, Nile, know that.
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Post by HoppersSkippersMiners on Jul 16, 2012 11:44:28 GMT -5
[sighs] Back home. Requesting my Monday morning(-ish) requests. Feeling depressed at seeming futility at all. Not that I'm going to stop requesting - it shows continued interest which is really important in the long run - just knowing it isn't going to make a visible difference in the short run. I know that we're in "marathon" mode. But it sure would be nice to see some effective sprints in the middle. Hating RCA and their stupid safe choices right now.  :( |
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Post by bullsfan on Jul 16, 2012 11:49:47 GMT -5
Well, I have stopped requesting (don't throw anything!) But, at least in the Chicago area, I feel like my daily text is accomplishing nothing at this point. And, honestly, I have lost enthusiasm in the song.
Ok, RCA, the ball is in your court.
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Post by HoppersSkippersMiners on Jul 16, 2012 12:13:11 GMT -5
Oh, I'm still requesting. As long as any Adam song is on the Mediabase forms, I'll do my once daily (still request WWFM on the HAC station that plays it and will never play NCOE). I just grit my teeth while doing it. |
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Post by Q3 on Jul 16, 2012 12:46:07 GMT -5
Here are last week's sales for Trespassing: 165 LAMBERT*ADAM TRESPASSING 3,273 -9 3,578 138,027 ?? WILL THERE BE A THIRD SINGLE? Let's see... I've heard it takes $1 million to promo an album. COrrect??? or is it $1 M for promo on a single? He's only sold approx. 133, 000 albums. Does anyone know the number of CD that would put him in the black? Is is 100,000 , 250,000 or 500,00 to cover expenses, etc. SInce the first two singles went not successful, will RCA take the chance and put out more $$$ for another single? I won't take into account his international sales since I'm sure that is on a separate budget line. Or will they just release another single, hopefully, CUCKOO, (cause I think that's their best shot which tweenies would like) and take a chance that PD's will add, or will they decided to invest more $$$$ and put full backing into a new single? It's a business, so what do you think RCA will do? The decision making process and economics are too complicated to answer by sayings selling X number of CD units = another single. Adam is a pretty sharp business person and may have controlled costs far more tightly than we imagine. It CAN cost $1,000,000 to promote a single to Pop radio. From what I can tell, RCA has not spent that kind of money on either BTIKM or NCOE. The "they" that needs to decide whether to invest in a 3rd single includes Adam. Not sure what they will decide to do but I think a Fall single is possible, not certain, since he will not tour until 2013. Decisions on what to do regarding singles are made within market -- in most cases by a country manager. |
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swarm
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Post by swarm on Jul 16, 2012 12:50:47 GMT -5
I think maybe the problem is that in most cases it's the song that breaks the artist. The song comes first which introduces the audience to the artist naturally. People hear a song and then discover the singer. Does that make sense? With Adam they are going about it in the complete opposite way by trying to break the artist first with the song coming after. Obviously, this is the result of coming off a singing competition, but can it work if you're not a cute boy band? Agreed. I stipulate I know nothing about the UK but this scenario is true in the US. However, the song is introduced by radio. And radio chooses it by deal making or investing in the insiders and ~stars. And IMO the stars can release anything and still make top 10 if radio just plays it. Case in point Beiber. Nobody came up high on the charts without bringing a big following either in the UK or utube phenom, right? And having insider backing. Even Frank Ocean, who kicked Adam's butt at #2, while he can be considered to be a "newcomer" really is NOT, he's an insider who's been working as a songwriter for awhile now. AND in the urban genre. IMO unless Adam gets a big sales bump THIS week from Queen press, highly unlikely, the experiment is that radio will NOT play him anywhere outside of their own convenience and case is closed for now. So he goes and becomes a touring artist, UGH, which, I believe was the comment that started the Dark Side thread when Trespassing was dropped and radio was falling. LOL. From a personal perspective I think by next year he's going to be "over it". You can only bang your head against the wall for so long. Absent another big event in the US like a SNL appearance, what's left but Idol judging, which seems to be another stunt to use him for hits IMO. Although his face seemed to suggest otherwise so.... If I were Adam I'd book as many Queen gigs as the market demands and hope that the audiences are as great as this month, which I don't even know if the demand is there for anything more than a few? And what venue size? Who knows - only the possible promoters I guess. :-/ |
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swarm
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Post by swarm on Jul 16, 2012 13:10:42 GMT -5
?? WILL THERE BE A THIRD SINGLE? Let's see... I've heard it takes $1 million to promo an album. COrrect??? or is it $1 M for promo on a single? He's only sold approx. 133, 000 albums. Does anyone know the number of CD that would put him in the black? Is is 100,000 , 250,000 or 500,00 to cover expenses, etc. SInce the first two singles went not successful, will RCA take the chance and put out more $$$ for another single? I won't take into account his international sales since I'm sure that is on a separate budget line. Or will they just release another single, hopefully, CUCKOO, (cause I think that's their best shot which tweenies would like) and take a chance that PD's will add, or will they decided to invest more $$$$ and put full backing into a new single? It's a business, so what do you think RCA will do? My guess purely uneducated is they may throw out a third single and not promote it. But I don't think Adam is deep in the red. I would bet he would have made a deal to take fewer points, change the royalties, and even forked over his own "money" to net black with RCA. Nobody knows what Trespassing "cost" because there are so many collabs on there etc. But we can guess the RCA stable including Dr Luke, Sam, BC Jean and other everyday peeps were "reasonable". IMO. Adam's father tweeted something about liking Pop That Lock more and more especially since "radio won't play it" months ago. I'm sure this has all been discussed by Adam and company and anticipated way in advance of radio's performance including with RCA. He's not the only artist on their roster without a huge popularity in the "mainstream". It's not for nothing that he was "relieved" that he debuted #1 and has all great reviews for Trespassing. A good thing, imo. And like someone else said, it was RCA trying to make him a Bruno Mars so they have their share of accountability. Not that they can't be snakes about it but I get the impression they really want him to succeed and genuinely like him. Incompetent as they are. I think they have more problems on their hands with that Sammy Adams kid they're pushing, albeit he hasn't cost them anything LOL. |
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Post by Q3 on Jul 16, 2012 13:24:55 GMT -5
I think maybe the problem is that in most cases it's the song that breaks the artist. The song comes first which introduces the audience to the artist naturally. People hear a song and then discover the singer. Does that make sense? With Adam they are going about it in the complete opposite way by trying to break the artist first with the song coming after. Obviously, this is the result of coming off a singing competition, but can it work if you're not a cute boy band? Agreed. I stipulate I know nothing about the UK but this scenario is true in the US. However, the song is introduced by radio. And radio chooses it by deal making or investing in the insiders and ~stars. And IMO the stars can release anything and still make top 10 if radio just plays it. Case in point Beiber. Nobody came up high on the charts without bringing a big following either in the UK or utube phenom, right? And having insider backing. Even Frank Ocean, who kicked Adam's butt at #2, while he can be considered to be a "newcomer" really is NOT, he's an insider who's been working as a songwriter for awhile now. AND in the urban genre. IMO unless Adam gets a big sales bump THIS week from Queen press, highly unlikely, the experiment is that radio will NOT play him anywhere outside of their own convenience and case is closed for now. So he goes and becomes a touring artist, UGH, which, I believe was the comment that started the Dark Side thread when Trespassing was dropped and radio was falling. LOL. From a personal perspective I think by next year he's going to be "over it". You can only bang your head against the wall for so long. Absent another big event in the US like a SNL appearance, what's left but Idol judging, which seems to be another stunt to use him for hits IMO. Although his face seemed to suggest otherwise so.... The referenced comment had nothing to do with the start of the Dark Side Thread. I started the Dark Side Thread because I was tired of mindless negativity and was hoping to inspire a fact-based, intelligent dialog in that thread. **** Bieber built his fanbase and sales mostly without radio support because his fans were too young to be of interest to radio. He is treated better now but since is one of the most popular artists in the world, what is the issue? **** The UK market is very different than the US market. First of all, CD stocking levels are based on past sales performance and very conservative. Adam could not have debuted at #2 there because there were not enough CDs in the stores to do it. **** Broadcast radio is dying -- and is now #2 media for influencing music buying decisions -- online is #1 and streaming media is the current king of online. 54% of streaming music users are male and 46% are female globally, with more users in Norway, Spain, Sweden and France than anywhere else. On average, 32% of the population streams music, which is exactly the penetration of usage in the US.While streaming music reaches close to 50% of 16 to 24 year olds, it also reaches 33% of 35 to 54 year olds and 23% of 55 to 64 year olds.Link: futureofradioonline.com/But forget streaming audio -- because we are entering the era of streaming video. In North America, local broadcast radio owned the car space. My new car has internet + satellite + broadcast radio. Why ever would I listen to local broadcast radio when I can stream from my own cloud or my own streaming playlist? Even in my old car, I can play music from my smart phone. **** SNL will not do much for Adam -- but it seems to be something that fans who do not look at ratings and demos have grabbed on to. Mostly based on what SNL once was. **** Two single that most Adam fans would not have picked were meh in terms of sales and radio airplay. Based on RTM and other polls -- of the 4 possible single options, fans picked NCOE last. Based on iTunes the "hit" is probably Trespassing. So if I was Empress of RCA, I will have Adam rerecord Trespassing with Brian May, Roger and Rufus Taylor, get John Deacon out of retirement on bass, and add the rest of the new Queen band. And put out a Queenbert single written by Adam F. Lambert. Get Pharrel to produce the new version. **** Setting aside my wacky idea. Where does Adam go from here? He does what musicians have done for decades -- on the road, doing concerts and interviews. Performing at festivals and radio concerts. And probably doing some collaborate with Brian May and Roger Taylor. He probably does a big event or two like the AMAs with Queen. And he tours, and gets great reviews and build his reputation and fan base. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2012 14:32:49 GMT -5
[sighs] Back home. Requesting my Monday morning(-ish) requests. Feeling depressed at seeming futility at all. Not that I'm going to stop requesting - it shows continued interest which is really important in the long run - just knowing it isn't going to make a visible difference in the short run. I know that we're in "marathon" mode. But it sure would be nice to see some effective sprints in the middle. Hating RCA and their stupid safe choices right now. :( Your local station WIAD has actually increased spins the past week, so please do keeep requesting!  |
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swarm
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Post by swarm on Jul 16, 2012 14:41:31 GMT -5
Q3 asked:As a result of my statement: You're right I shouldn't assume people know what I'm talking about if I'm being cryptic.  I am referencing the extremely informative article "How Radio Got Back With Justin Beiber" when Boyfriend failed to peak where the label wanted it to and went full court press with radio to give it a second chance, wherein: "Everyone (at radio) believed in the song and programmed this song to win," echoes Island Def Jam EVP of promotion Rick Sackheim..."www.billboard.com/column-chartbeat/how-radio-got-back-with-justin-bieber-s-1007215152.story#/column-chartbeat/how-radio-got-back-with-justin-bieber-s-1007215152.storyI would never in a million years say Beiber was lacking radio support if anything he is the darling of radio. After radio "programmed the song to win" all we had to do was look at the radio websites to see several sidebars and blocks devoted to him on the landing page, with free concert promotions and other incentives. And rightly so because Def Jam made the case based on what radio believes to be solid "research". The criteria is documented in the article. This happened to coincide with a point in time that we were having difficulties even finding Adam on radio websites including the new iHeart radio simple videos, let alone free concert tix (yes I know he didn't have any but still...) and merch promo or giveaways. Frank Ocean Channel Orange is with Def Jam. After the large shout out from Russell Simmons to Ocean, no way was he going to fail with radio or sales. Which is why I'm saying about insider connections. The business is very incestuous right now and Adam is not a member of the family. As he's said.
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:(
