skylar
Member
Posts: 1,686
Location:
|
Post by skylar on Aug 22, 2011 22:07:09 GMT -5
I'm just going to comment on the general issue and why it rubs me the wrong way because it crops up from time to time. Also I'll preface that I'm certain adamme didn't mean anything by it and just wanted to express her appreciation for Sauli. Leaving aside Adam and who he is or has dated and what his preferences are, because that isn't the real issue, when I see a statement saying that manly is more preferable to flamboyant or effeminate, or that a boyfriend who "fit's in" more or doesn't have certain "mannerisms" is to be preferred, it comes across as homophobic to me. ETA: or what kittykay said Yes. This. Adamme I don't want you to feel you are being ganged up on. (I know what that feels like) This is an interesting subject and it is always enlightening in discussions such as this one when we are called to look a little deeper and to understand a little more why we feel the way we do. We are all learning together and sharing helps US evolve. |
|
NoAngel
Member
Take a bow, Adam Lambert, you fucking legend.
Posts: 2,575
Location:
|
Post by NoAngel on Aug 22, 2011 22:08:55 GMT -5
I'm just going to comment on the general issue and why it rubs me the wrong way because it crops up from time to time. Also I'll preface that I'm certain adamme didn't mean anything by it and just wanted to express her appreciation for Sauli. Leaving aside Adam and who he is or has dated and what his preferences are, because that isn't the real issue, when I see a statement saying that manly is more preferable to flamboyant or effeminate, or that a boyfriend who "fit's in" more or doesn't have certain "mannerisms" is to be preferred, it comes across as homophobic to me. ETA: or what kittykay said To extrapolate to the real world. I am taking a traing class at work our instructor is from New York, very sweet and well groomed. He was gone today and the class asked HR for a new instructor because he was obviously gay because his nail beds were shined, not even polished. HR's response is he was from the city and we can't assume he is homosexual he could be metrosexual. I had to leave the room after expressing my disgust with the whole conversation. How is the "effeminate" male conversation any less offensive? Do people not like Adam as much when he shows his feminine side? Wow, Kittykay, this story makes me so sad...  *sigh* We still have such a long way to go. What the hell are people afraid of? I think the whole masculine/feminine conversation is fascinating, and reminds me of what we were talking about yesterday. Demeaning the feminine (in both women AND men) is mysogynistic. I must admit I cringe a bit when I hear some people say they prefer Adam to look more "masculine." I mean, I know it's often just an expression of preference in terms of what you personally find attractive, but Adam is no less a man when he is wearing fishnet stockings and a dress than he is when he's wearing jeans and a t-shirt. It's just that he's not in the box that our society calls "masculine." It's all just so limiting, and yes, this is exactly what Adam wishes we could all evolve beyond. |
|
|
|
Post by kittykay on Aug 22, 2011 22:09:05 GMT -5
Why is it necessary to cut down others to support Sauli? I find the comment "fit in everywhere" very homophobic. Isn't that the attitude we are all fighting against? Isn't Adam working hard to educate the masses to embrace their individuality? I'm sorry if this is coming across as too strong. I am dealing with just this issue at work. I didn't expect the attitudes here. I didn't read "fit in" as homophobic at all. I have had boyfriends that I thought could fit in in a variety of situations, and some that could not. Some were lost if they accompanied me to the symphony, but did great at a football party with friends. Some fit in at the symphony, but didn't relate well with my professional colleagues. Then, there were a few that I could take to a family gathering, a museum, a staff function, sailing, or to a bridal shower, and they fit in. I never had to worry about them. As for evolving, aren't we all? Adam himself, in an interview, said that because his life was changing so much, his taste in a partner might also change. I know that my choice in relationships changed for the better and occasionally for the worse, depending on where I was at the time. (Can you say, "approaching 40 and not married, a little desperate, figuring I needed to 'settle' and not be so picky?" "Can you say disaster?") Ultimately, we all hated when family and friends started giving us advice about the suitability and desirability of our boyfriends or girlfriends. And they had at least met them! I'm going with my mother's perspective. She always said, "Whoever treats you well and makes you happy, I will like. If they don't I don't care how wealthy, good looking, charming, or successful they are. I won't like them." Yay, Mom! I agree that some people do just naturally fit in any social situation. I object to the phrase being used insinuating they didn't "fit in" because they are effeminate. There doesn't seem to be anything socially awkward about Brad. Drake was uncomfortable with the spotlight of fame. It has been my experience that it isn't always that two people can't make it work because of not being right for each other, but often the time isn't right. Each person that enters our lives shapes us to be who we are. |
|
cookie
Member
Posts: 1,988
Location:
|
Post by cookie on Aug 22, 2011 22:09:16 GMT -5
We've had this debate at least 27 times before. I hate to see a re-run spoil the glee of the evening. Our pleasure in his current relationship doesn't have anything to do with the value of his previous relationships. Sauli may be my favorite boyfriend I will never actually know, but Adam cared about them all. I wanna go back to staring at the pretty...  |
|
|
|
Post by evergreen on Aug 22, 2011 22:09:23 GMT -5
OK, to get serious now... :  Have you noticed how often in group pictures that lots of people have red-eye, but Adam seldom does? And Sauli is the same. They both have beautiful eyes... |
|
cookie
Member
Posts: 1,988
Location:
|
Post by cookie on Aug 22, 2011 22:14:03 GMT -5
OK, to get serious now... : Have you noticed how often in group pictures that lots of people have red-eye, but Adam seldom does? And Sauli is the same. They both have beautiful eyes... LOL! I have noticed that- and I want to figure out how to do it myself! |
|
|
|
Post by durberville on Aug 22, 2011 22:15:14 GMT -5
OK, to get serious now... : Have you noticed how often in group pictures that lots of people have red-eye, but Adam seldom does? And Sauli is the same. They both have beautiful eyes... Yes!! I've noticed that!! Hahaha!.... look at the two of them- shock of ebony hair, shock of silver hair, two gorgeous faces cuddled up together....gah! I'm not one to "right-click-save" photos - but this is now my desktop....it just makes me a Happy Yappy!! ;D ;D |
|
|
|
Post by marie23 on Aug 22, 2011 22:15:46 GMT -5
DEAD DYING DEAD  Just WOW. Really, this picture needs to be on every page (at least for today). Is that Adam's skull ring on Sauli's hand? Been quiet today, but just lurking and loving the pictures. Adam looks so perfectly handsome, and both him and sauli are just glowing with happiness. Even though I always liked Sauli, but i think that he just looks so beautiful here, not just pretty but gorgeous, very androgynous. That hair, or something about him makes that masculine/feminine line really blurred. Usually when I look at these pics my eyes just go straight to Adam, but in this pic, I'm drawn to both. Absolutely stunning... |
|
|
|
Post by revlisacat on Aug 22, 2011 22:17:24 GMT -5
Cassie -- I agree with you on this one completely. I had one boyfriend who seemed proud to always be the most casual person in the room, dated a man who seemed to revel in being odd and some others I don't really want to remember... Anyway, it is great to have the companionship of someone who fits into all sorts of social situations (especially when part of your job is to fit into all sorts of social situations). I think Adam has good taste in men, and like everything else in his life his taste changes over time. One of the things I especially like about Sauli is that he is fundamentally a HAPPY person and not a worrier -- since Adam is a happy person, this is probably nice for both of them. Sauli has also spent time in the public eye and has his own achievements, which is helpful when dating a famous person--he just seems comfortable in his own skin. Adam did say to Perez this spring that it was difficult finding people to date when you are in the public eye.
|
|
|
|
Post by rabbitrabbit on Aug 22, 2011 22:17:43 GMT -5
I'm just going to comment on the general issue and why it rubs me the wrong way because it crops up from time to time. Also I'll preface that I'm certain adamme didn't mean anything by it and just wanted to express her appreciation for Sauli. Leaving aside Adam and who he is or has dated and what his preferences are, because that isn't the real issue, when I see a statement saying that manly is more preferable to flamboyant or effeminate, or that a boyfriend who "fit's in" more or doesn't have certain "mannerisms" is to be preferred, it comes across as homophobic to me. ETA: or what kittykay said To extrapolate to the real world. I am taking a traing class at work our instructor is from New York, very sweet and well groomed. He was gone today and the class asked HR for a new instructor because he was obviously gay because his nail beds were shined, not even polished. HR's response is he was from the city and we can't assume he is homosexual he could be metrosexual. I had to leave the room after expressing my disgust with the whole conversation. How is the "effeminate" male conversation any less offensive? Do people not like Adam as much when he shows his feminine side? Your story is rage-inducing. I wonder if your company has a non-discrimination policy, if so it might be worth privately pointing that out to the HR person, who should be the one to push back against these kind of complaints on the grounds that sexual orientation whether perceived or real has absolutely no bearing on someone's abilities. Then again I totally understanding choosing your battles depending on the context, and expressing your disgust and leaving the room was taking a public stand, good for you. |
|
